Where are C class long-haul pax disappearing?

The 14.8% is the number of transported passengers. It's on the statistics page so is available to everyone.

And here you are making a very significant error which in turn affects your analysis.

The 14.8% listed on the statistics page is not passengers transported, but capacity deployed.

And yes, it can be easily proven that it's this way :-)

So those 14.8% does not tell us anything about how many passengers in C class were actually transported, only that the C seats comprise 14.8% of available capacity.

The point is you cannot find out the load factor of others business class. All you know is they are not 100%. They may be 1% or 99%…

Well on many flights you can. If there are 3 bookable seats in C and the flight has capacity of 15 seats in C the load factor is 80%. You cannot determine C class load factor with precision only when bookable seats show 9.

On ORS?

On ORS?

Market Analysis ;)

The passengers are there despite what you think. It's up to you to find them and attract them to your airline :)

I know it is not a obligatory, but I wait for your reply or explanation for more than week... So I try to ask again:

What then do attract economy pax to my airline, if the connections are the same and prices and ratings in ORS are worse than in C class?

I can only assume that it must be less competition in Y class that still gives you those pax. Or the competitors Y class is even worse than yours?

I can only assume that it must be less competition in Y class that still gives you those pax. Or the competitors Y class is even worse than yours?

What do you call "competition"? Nobody here (except team) has core data of real poin-to-point pax flow.

As I mentioned before, I keep more than 65% of capacity on all FCO-TATL flights  and I am only carier on Italy-LAX/SFO routes, for example. Rating / Eq in Y is 61/100 and 80/100 in C.

Economy is filled up immediately after first demand calculation (171pax),  in business I carry approximately 3-8 pax only on each flight....

Three points...

1) I've told you how to improve your bookings...clearly a waste of time

2) Who says there has to be direct demand, I don't see any FCO-SFO flights in real life?

3) IF there is direct demand who is to say that the demand is not 500 per day in Y (hence full), and 3 per day in C? Just because Y is full that does not mean C should be

What do you call "competition"? Nobody here (except team) has core data of real poin-to-point pax flow.

 

As I mentioned before, I keep more than 65% of capacity on all FCO-TATL flights  and I am only carier on Italy-LAX/SFO routes, for example. Rating / Eq in Y is 61/100 and 80/100 in C.

Economy is filled up immediately after first demand calculation (171pax),  in business I carry approximately 3-8 pax only on each flight…

How many connecting passengers do you have after your first demand calculation? Is it a few, or more like 170?

Three points...

1) I've told you how to improve your bookings...clearly a waste of time

2) Who says there has to be direct demand, I don't see any FCO-SFO flights in real life?

3) IF there is direct demand who is to say that the demand is not 500 per day in Y (hence full), and 3 per day in C? Just because Y is full that does not mean C should be

1. Out of my point again....

2. ??????? Are you serious?

3. For first time you are close to my point, so I try to ask this simply way: do you think, that 500Y/3C are "normal" numbers for longhaul?

 

How many connecting passengers do you have after your first demand calculation? Is it a few, or more like 170?

Booking is Y171/C4, with these numbers:

From ext. feeder: 118

From own feeder: 52

To ext. connection: 25

There is no direct flight between FCO and SFO: http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=FCO-SFO

If you have that many connecting passengers then it means that there is very little direct demand.

Possibly your IL partners have a shitty C product and therefore carry few C Pax to your flight? Or don't have enough capacity in C?

I was using the numbers as an example. I have no idea what the real numbers are. But on the basis there is no FCO-SFO then direct demand should actually be zero, and therefore you are relying on connections which puts us back to square one

Booking is Y171/C4, with these numbers:

From ext. feeder: 118

From own feeder: 52

To ext. connection: 25

there you go... 118 + 52 = 170 - meaning there is just one passenger who isn't flown in from somewehre else.

Taking this to the next iteration: You might have ORS of 100 on the particular segment (FCO-SFO) but the combination of a feeder (lets say CDG-FCO) and your trans atlantic segment may be a lot worse...

I just checked: As an example I took a connection from FLR to SFO, as you offer FLR - FCO in high frequency. On this route the most attractive routings in C are via Munich, which tells me that your C product as a whole could be optimized...

To prove the point I founded Pizza Air in Otto 6 days ago. The fleet features one B788, C Class only, using 75 full bed wide, and the onboard service is as good as it can be. Default prices The results are....

FCO - LAX = 2 passengers each way

FCO - SFO = 0 passengers each way

So we can assume there is almost zero direct demand for these flights. And therefore any passengers you had were connections. Now there are more opportunities for routings and you've stubbornly stuck to your business model rather than adapt passengers have gone to other airlines...